Scottish Independence Referendum 2

[Parklife]

7 hours ago, Jocky Balboa said:

While some are straying further from the topic and disappearing down a sky pixie-themed rabbit hole, the noose is tightening around the stinking corruption of the Murrell Mafia's inner circle. Surely the FM can't survive now?

You make it sound like a synopsis for an upcoming Taggart episode. 

[Jocky Balboa]

On 1/22/2021 at 7:46 AM, Parklife said:

You make it sound like a synopsis for an upcoming Taggart episode. 

Nothing so dramatic, but attempting to put an innocent man in jail for the rest of his natural life, on sex charges which were so ridiculous the FM and her administration were advised not to proceed on, is pretty corrupt, is it not? It's also a huge slap in the face to the many genuine victims of sex assault (both male and female) who struggle to be heard, far less see justice.

If the FM and her husband don't see the inside of a jail cell at the end of this, it will be a disgrace to Scottish justice.

[Parklife]

2 minutes ago, Jocky Balboa said:

Nothing so dramatic, but attempting to put an innocent man in jail for the rest of his natural life, on sex charges which were so ridiculous the FM and her administration were advised not to proceed on, is pretty corrupt, is it not? It's also a huge slap in the face to the many genuine victims of sex assault (both male and female) who struggle to be heard, far less see justice.

If the FM and her husband don't see the inside of a jail cell at the end of this, it will be a disgrace to Scottish justice.

I was just making a joke, trying to inject some humour. 

I agree that it looks very much like Salmond was set up (Ive said so on here several times). Quite how high that goes, I don't know. I don't believe it goes as high as Sturgeon. She may have lied about when she was told things but I don't believe she was part of any conspiracy to set him up. 

Maybe I'm naive and will be proved wrong. 

[Henry]

In a new plan for indyref2 – revealed exclusively by The National today – the SNP are set to tell the Prime Minister that he’ll need to take legal action if he wants to stop Scots voters having their say on the constitution. Michael Russell outlines how they will do it

1. The Scottish Parliament has already passed two bills that lay the groundwork for a referendum on independence. The first was the Referendums (Scotland) Bill which became law on January 29, 2020. The Scottish Elections (Franchise & Representation) Bill was then passed in February and gained Royal Assent on April 1. 
 
2. These two bills set out the general rules for any referendum and the franchise that would apply to all referendums held in Scotland. 
 
3. This approach, which is different from that taken in 2013/4 require details of any particular referendum – question, timescale and some specific regulations – to be passed by the Parliament and accordingly only a further short bill is required to complete the legislative preparations for a second independence referendum 
 
4. Work on that bill and on other independence-related tasks was suspended on March 16, 2020 as a result of the need to deploy as many civil servants as possible to work on Scotland’s response to the pandemic. 
 
5. The SNP Scottish Government announced in the Programme for Government in September 2020 that a draft bill for an independence referendum, to give people in Scotland the right to choose their own future, would be published before the Holyrood election in May 2021 and would be enacted if an SNP Scottish Government is re-elected with a majority to do so (either as a result of gaining an overall majority or if it had such a majority as a result of support from another pro-independence party). 

 

READ MORE: SNP unveils plan to hold indyref2 – even if Boris Johnson says no
 
6. The draft bill will be published as planned and the SNP Scottish Government will include the promise to enact the bill in its manifesto. 
 
7. The SNP Scottish Government continues to maintain that a referendum must be beyond legal challenge to ensure legitimacy and acceptance at home and abroad. This is the surest way by far of becoming an independent country. It should be held after the pandemic, at a time to be decided by the democratically elected Scottish Parliament. The SNP believes that should be in the early part of the new term. 

8. If the SNP takes office the Scottish Government will again request a Section 30 order from the UK Government believing and publicly contending that in such circumstances there could be no moral or democratic justification for denying that request. If the UK Government were to adopt such a position its position would be unsustainable both at home and abroad. 
 
9. However, in the election, the SNP’s proposition, for which we will be seeking the express authority of the Scottish people, will be clear and unambiguous – if there is a parliamentary majority so to do, we will introduce and pass a bill so that the necessary arrangements for the referendum can be made and implemented thereafter once the pandemic is over.

Nicola Sturgeon will hold a legal referendum if Westminster says no

10. In these circumstances, in which there has been an unambiguously expressed democratic decision by the people of Scotland and their Parliament to have a legal referendum the choice of the UK Government will be clear; to either (1) agree that the Scottish Parliament already 
has the power to legislate for a referendum or (2) in line with precedent, agree the Section 30 order to put that question beyond any doubt or (3) take legal action to dispute the legal basis of the referendum and seek to block the will of the Scottish people in the courts. Such a legal challenge would be vigorously opposed by an SNP Scottish Government.

11. The issue of whether there should be such a referendum is different from the issue of whether Scotland should be independent. A national campaign of information and education on independence. Hopefully within the 
context of a renewed and widely 
based Yes campaign, will take place in parallel with the work being done to organise the referendum during and after the bill’s passage.

* The National recently hit 11,000 digital subscribers. Every single subscriber who signs up means we can better make the case for independence. Join us today at www.thenational.scot/subscribe

 

 

 

     

 

 

 

 

 

[Joe pike]

Sturgeon is 100% guilty of trying to fit up Salmond .If anybody has watched the last few times she has been asked about this on her tv show ,the expression on her face spelled out GUILTY.Like a toddler caught with their hand in the sweetie box.

I think she has believed her own hype and thought she was indestructible and could do what she wanted.The SNP are run like a gangster outfit who think there is no comeback on them no matter what they get up to.

She has shown how devious she is by trying to force a court case on Salmond even though the advice was to drop it.This alone should get her sacked as Salmond had to be paid £550,000 legal costs for a wrongful prosecution..

They have hindered the Parliamentary committee that are investigating this at every opportunity by refusing to hand over evidence and even though they have now been forced into revealing this,a lot of texts,messages and documents could have already been deleted.

Looks like her spin is finally falling apart.

[NEM]

2 hours ago, Jocky Balboa said:

 

If the FM and her husband don't see the inside of a jail cell at the end of this, it will be a disgrace to Scottish justice.

Things you’d absolutely love to see ?

[caledonia]

Sturgeon is on Marr tomorrow morning.

[Fridge]

But why? What did she gain from it when they were as thick as thieves before?

[frankie_mac's_4]

Murky world of politics fridge - we'll never know for sure. Might be to do with the alleged hidden camera footage fae the women's bogs at Holyrood if you believe the rumours 

[The beard of mcinnes]

4 hours ago, Henry said:

In a new plan for indyref2 – revealed exclusively by The National today – the SNP are set to tell the Prime Minister that he’ll need to take legal action if he wants to stop Scots voters having their say on the constitution. Michael Russell outlines how they will do it

1. The Scottish Parliament has already passed two bills that lay the groundwork for a referendum on independence. The first was the Referendums (Scotland) Bill which became law on January 29, 2020. The Scottish Elections (Franchise & Representation) Bill was then passed in February and gained Royal Assent on April 1. 
 
2. These two bills set out the general rules for any referendum and the franchise that would apply to all referendums held in Scotland. 
 
3. This approach, which is different from that taken in 2013/4 require details of any particular referendum – question, timescale and some specific regulations – to be passed by the Parliament and accordingly only a further short bill is required to complete the legislative preparations for a second independence referendum 
 
4. Work on that bill and on other independence-related tasks was suspended on March 16, 2020 as a result of the need to deploy as many civil servants as possible to work on Scotland’s response to the pandemic. 
 
5. The SNP Scottish Government announced in the Programme for Government in September 2020 that a draft bill for an independence referendum, to give people in Scotland the right to choose their own future, would be published before the Holyrood election in May 2021 and would be enacted if an SNP Scottish Government is re-elected with a majority to do so (either as a result of gaining an overall majority or if it had such a majority as a result of support from another pro-independence party). 

 

READ MORE: SNP unveils plan to hold indyref2 – even if Boris Johnson says no
 
6. The draft bill will be published as planned and the SNP Scottish Government will include the promise to enact the bill in its manifesto. 
 
7. The SNP Scottish Government continues to maintain that a referendum must be beyond legal challenge to ensure legitimacy and acceptance at home and abroad. This is the surest way by far of becoming an independent country. It should be held after the pandemic, at a time to be decided by the democratically elected Scottish Parliament. The SNP believes that should be in the early part of the new term. 

8. If the SNP takes office the Scottish Government will again request a Section 30 order from the UK Government believing and publicly contending that in such circumstances there could be no moral or democratic justification for denying that request. If the UK Government were to adopt such a position its position would be unsustainable both at home and abroad. 
 
9. However, in the election, the SNP’s proposition, for which we will be seeking the express authority of the Scottish people, will be clear and unambiguous – if there is a parliamentary majority so to do, we will introduce and pass a bill so that the necessary arrangements for the referendum can be made and implemented thereafter once the pandemic is over.

Nicola Sturgeon will hold a legal referendum if Westminster says no

10. In these circumstances, in which there has been an unambiguously expressed democratic decision by the people of Scotland and their Parliament to have a legal referendum the choice of the UK Government will be clear; to either (1) agree that the Scottish Parliament already 
has the power to legislate for a referendum or (2) in line with precedent, agree the Section 30 order to put that question beyond any doubt or (3) take legal action to dispute the legal basis of the referendum and seek to block the will of the Scottish people in the courts. Such a legal challenge would be vigorously opposed by an SNP Scottish Government.

11. The issue of whether there should be such a referendum is different from the issue of whether Scotland should be independent. A national campaign of information and education on independence. Hopefully within the 
context of a renewed and widely 
based Yes campaign, will take place in parallel with the work being done to organise the referendum during and after the bill’s passage.

* The National recently hit 11,000 digital subscribers. Every single subscriber who signs up means we can better make the case for independence. Join us today at www.thenational.scot/subscribe

 

 

 

     

 

 

 

 

 

New plan every week in the National 

[Bluto10]

Scottish politics 

 

LOL

[The Boofon]

15 hours ago, Joe pike said:

Sturgeon is 100% guilty of trying to fit up Salmond .If anybody has watched the last few times she has been asked about this on her tv show ,the expression on her face spelled out GUILTY.Like a toddler caught with their hand in the sweetie box.

I think she has believed her own hype and thought she was indestructible and could do what she wanted.The SNP are run like a gangster outfit who think there is no comeback on them no matter what they get up to.

She has shown how devious she is by trying to force a court case on Salmond even though the advice was to drop it.This alone should get her sacked as Salmond had to be paid £550,000 legal costs for a wrongful prosecution..

They have hindered the Parliamentary committee that are investigating this at every opportunity by refusing to hand over evidence and even though they have now been forced into revealing this,a lot of texts,messages and documents could have already been deleted.

Looks like her spin is finally falling apart.

Why did you choose Joe Pike as a username?

[The Boofon]

6 minutes ago, Bad_Mobby said:

How did Krankie McMerkel get on with Johnny Marr earlier? 

Shagged him.

[caledonia]

33 minutes ago, The Boofon said:

Why did you choose Joe Pike as a username?

Because Sturgeon and Salmond were taken.

[Parklife]

54 minutes ago, The Boofon said:

Why did you choose Joe Pike as a username?

Oi. That's my line! 

[The Boofon]

1 minute ago, Parklife said:

Oi. That's my line! 

I've said that plenty.

[Jocky Balboa]

17 hours ago, Fridge said:

But why? What did she gain from it when they were as thick as thieves before?

That is a very good question and one which hasn't been answered yet. Who knows if the full truth will ever out. A fee theories that have been posited however;

- At the deep end, some online commenters think she's a double agent (on balance, some say her opponents like Rev Campbell are similarly compromised) with the logic being, if the British state made it high up in the IRA and environmental groups, surely the SNP have agents as well.

- Some say she never forgave the fact he stepped into the leadership contest after Swinney stepped down and she had to settle for second best for a decade

- Some say she suffered/suffers from imposter syndrome and always had an inferiority complex about filling his shoes

- There is also the RT show and AS's continuing high profile, which meant she was always sharing the limelight with her predecessor

- It's been suggested her team did this to try and stop him making a political comeback

- Many people (including myself) believe that whether some of the above are true or not, she has been seduced by power, like so many before her and as many after her will undoubtedly be

[Parklife]

Serious question Jocky but you've been critical in the past of the SNP and said you feel they don't really care about independence and care more about being in power (I'm paraphrasing, apologies if you feel that's inaccurate). However, do you feel what appears to be a more aggressive approach to Indy this week (essentially saying we'll hold a referendum regardless) is a step in the right direction? 

[frankie_mac's_4]

35 minutes ago, Jocky Balboa said:

- It's been suggested her team did this to try and stop him making a political comeback

^In all seriousness this is my gut instinct on the whole thing. An internal schism within the SNP that's now boiling over into the public domain. Whether Sturgeon and her inner circle are complicit in any underhand doings is the one key question, but even if she's not complicit she's now on the edge of losing party unity and party control.

[Joe pike]

2 hours ago, rocket_scientist said:

Let's not rule out the possibility that the two of them had relations of an intimate kind, whether consensual or whether he tried it on with her.

He was correctly found innocent because the evidence didn't prove beyond reasonable doubt but let's not kid ourselves, he's a sleazeball groper who's behaviour wasn't illegal when he was a younger man. Married a hook-nosed ugly woman who is much older than him so probably coveted extra curricular. He's a fucking weirdo. 

Does'nt say a lot for Salmonds judgement if he tried it on with Sturgeon.

I think he would know the score.

[Clydeside_Sheep]

On 1/22/2021 at 12:45 AM, Jocky Balboa said:

While some are straying further from the topic and disappearing down a sky pixie-themed rabbit hole, the noose is tightening around the stinking corruption of the Murrell Mafia's inner circle. Surely the FM can't survive now?

Sturgeon has aged years in the last few months.  Obviously someone struggling with stress and worry.

Did you see her on the BBC with Andrew Marr?  I thought she looked ill!

 

[Clydeside_Sheep]

On 1/23/2021 at 9:31 PM, Fridge said:

But why? What did she gain from it when they were as thick as thieves before?

The Robin McAlpine article suggests the idea of Sturgeon's cabal was only to smear Salmond's reputation, to prevent him returning to politics and usurping Sturgeon.

However, he then claims the thing took legs and ran on to the point of Salmond facing jail - and, terrifyingly, he claims Sturgeon & Co just decided to "go with it" instead of backing off.

 

[Joe pike]

23 minutes ago, Clydeside_Sheep said:

Sturgeon has aged years in the last few months.  Obviously someone struggling with stress and worry.

Did you see her on the BBC with Andrew Marr?  I thought she looked ill!

 

I said the exact same thing.The bags under eyes were unreal.She looked ghastly.

The lighting and make up depts must be excellent on her tv's show.

[The Boofon]

7 hours ago, Clydeside_Sheep said:

Sturgeon has aged years in the last few months.  Obviously someone struggling with stress and worry.

Did you see her on the BBC with Andrew Marr?  I thought she looked ill!

 

Yeah no idea why that would happen.

 

Mental.

[For Fecks Sake]

7 minutes ago, The Boofon said:

Yeah no idea why that would happen.

 

Mental.

Agree, I mean what the hell has she got to be worried about these past 12 months or so - fucking easy Street for any leader of a country at this particular point in time ?

[Clydeside_Sheep]

2 hours ago, The Boofon said:

Yeah no idea why that would happen.

 

2 hours ago, For Fecks Sake said:

Agree, I mean what the hell has she got to be worried about these past 12 months or so - fucking easy Street for any leader of a country at this particular point in time ?

Im very sure she is not worried about coronva virus, which isnt her fault and off the back of which she is receiving undeserved praise and unparalleled media exposure.

Corona virus is one of the few positives for her currently!

I think its far more likely she is worried that its likely her lies and malicious actions will be laid bare by this enquiry and end her career.

 

[The Boofon]

2 minutes ago, Clydeside_Sheep said:

 

Im very sure she is not worried about coronva virus, which isnt her fault and off the back of which she is receiving underserved praise and unparalleled media exposure.

Corona virus is one of the few positives for her currently!

I think its far more likely she is worried that its likely her lies and malicious actions will be laid bare by this enquiry and end her career.

 

Aye definitely.

 

Fucking hell.

 

[Clydeside_Sheep]

10 hours ago, Joe pike said:

I said the exact same thing.The bags under eyes were unreal.She looked ghastly.

The lighting and make up depts must be excellent on her tv's show.

Ghastly is the word.

Her make up was about 1" thick and yet still could not hide the massive dark bags under her eyes.

Obviously sitting up late with her husband, trying to recount what lies they have already told and what possible lies remain open to them in light of this.  Stressful business.

If this brings her down, there no obvious successor - unless the Salmond faction manages to retake the party.  However, by now it is stuffed with Sturgeon cultists and femi-nazi loyalists.

Her support would be more likely to try to elevate Humza Yousef, especially if Labour elect Anas Sarwar.  Homosexual predator Derek Mackay was meant to be her protege, but then he pissed on his chips. 

They would be happy with Yousef, as his background would still represent woke "progress"   (and match Labour in that regard) but he has nowhere near the Universal appeal of Sturgeon or Salmond.

[Ten Caat]

I can't believe they are threatening to run a wildcat referendum whilst this Salmond cloud hangs over their leader. Maybe it's an attempt to shift the focus away from it but until Sturgeon either clears her name (and by doing so finally ensures that Salmond can play no active role in politics again) or she's found guilty, alongside her husband and both are forced to resign their positions (in Sturgeon's case not just the First Minister's position but also her MSP seat). And possibly face their own days in court themselves.

Until this is sorted it's just a wide open goal for the remain parties to exploit and the opinion polls are bound to suffer in the interim. Sturgeon's handling of the coronavirus situation has been exemplary compared to Westminster but the goodwill from that is bound to wane soon, especially if the vaccination programme proves successful. Could take years to repair the damage  if she is brought down.

I agree Yousuf is probably the most likely replacement in the event the whole Sturgeon house of cards comes tumbling down. Safe pair of hands and as has been said, counteracts the likely Sarwar appointment, making the SNP look inclusive and forward thinking. I wouldn't discount a challenge coming in from Joanna Cherry though....even if Sturgeon survives. She's fucking fuming about what happened in Edinburgh Central and might be looking for a spot of revenge. Obviously she would tick different boxes to Yousuf but nonetheless would still look good on the diversity front.

 

 

[Don Fonte]

1 hour ago, Ten Caat said:

I can't believe they are threatening to run a wildcat referendum whilst this Salmond cloud hangs over their leader. Maybe it's an attempt to shift the focus away from it but until Sturgeon either clears her name (and by doing so finally ensures that Salmond can play no active role in politics again) or she's found guilty, alongside her husband and both are forced to resign their positions (in Sturgeon's case not just the First Minister's position but also her MSP seat). And possibly face their own days in court themselves.

Until this is sorted it's just a wide open goal for the remain parties to exploit and the opinion polls are bound to suffer in the interim. Sturgeon's handling of the coronavirus situation has been exemplary compared to Westminster but the goodwill from that is bound to wane soon, especially if the vaccination programme proves successful. Could take years to repair the damage  if she is brought down.

I agree Yousuf is probably the most likely replacement in the event the whole Sturgeon house of cards comes tumbling down. Safe pair of hands and as has been said, counteracts the likely Sarwar appointment, making the SNP look inclusive and forward thinking. I wouldn't discount a challenge coming in from Joanna Cherry though....even if Sturgeon survives. She's fucking fuming about what happened in Edinburgh Central and might be looking for a spot of revenge. Obviously she would tick different boxes to Yousuf but nonetheless would still look good on the diversity front.

 

 

@Grays Babylon 1875