Scottish Independence Referendum 2

[Clydeside_Sheep]

In fairness, going to Ireland to shoot the kafflicks is pretty much textbook hun. 

 

That's unfair imo, they were meant to be there as police / peacekeepers (not least given how compromised the indigenous police force was) and I reckon the rank and file of the army were in a sense some of the biggest victims of the tragedy of the troubles.  They suffered violence, but didn't have any personal stake in the matter.

 

Troops trained for flowing armoured warfare on the plains of western europe were suddenly thrust into policing a form of urban insurgency, which they were not trained or equipped for.  Any time they did what soldiers do - shoot people - they were criticised.  Their presence ended up a political coup for republicans, who could then present (and treat them) them as an occupying force.  The government put them in chiefly to avoid the indignity of having UN peacekeepers, and then could not withdraw them, because that would be yet another political coup for the republicans.

 

Recently I saw contemporary 70s footage of (english) troops being interviewed in the province.  Many seemed bewildered about the whole thing.  

 

One admitted it was hard not to take sides, given the differences in how they were treated.  "What do you think of Catholics?" the interviewer asked him.  "I am a Catholic" he said.  "But I don't like the northern Irish ones very much".

 

Another guy was very astute and stated using the Army was misguided and a political solution was needed.  He noted that the society was gravely unequal (deliberately so) and that it would need to be more equal before peace would return.  That was true, and it must have made his day all the worse to know that him risking his life daily was ultimately fruitless in terms of ending the violence and division.

[DD1903]

Total nonsense and the type of attitude that holds Scotland back as a country.

 

My parents think similarly sadly... fortunately yours and their generation will soon be gone and Scotland can become a proper, progressive country that takes responsibility for it's own affairs.

I love the use of the word progressive thats been creeping in to politics - particularly anything the SNP do.

 

What do you think we'd do that would make Scotland progressive? Scottish labour are a joke, as are the Tories. Having voted for Indy, I have no idea who I would have voted for to lead us through the separation process...Bearing in mind the snp love centralisation, taxing middle earners, have education policies that have resulted in poorer results, and a further education policy that encourages the unis to target foreign students for their cash...

[muttonhumper]

Sober up min. Scotland joined the Union in 1707 as everyone who was anyone at that time had been bankrupted by the Darien debacle and England refunded the losses as part of the agreement. I would also remind you that Scotland did pretty well out of the Empire and the profits built many of the finest buildings in our major cities. The Empire was created by force of arms, and I do not recall England forcing Scotland to take part and we were only too happy to join in the free for all. The fact is, which you don't seem to get, that most Scots are happy with the modern relationship despite the Tory cunts and there is no sign of a surge of support for Independence even with Brexit looming.

 

Confirmed.

 

Utterly fucking clueless.

[SheepieBaaBaa]

That's unfair imo, they were meant to be there as police / peacekeepers (not least given how compromised the indigenous police force was) and I reckon the rank and file of the army were in a sense some of the biggest victims of the tragedy of the troubles.  They suffered violence, but didn't have any personal stake in the matter.

 

Troops trained for flowing armoured warfare on the plains of western europe were suddenly thrust into policing a form of urban insurgency, which they were not trained or equipped for.  Any time they did what soldiers do - shoot people - they were criticised.  Their presence ended up a political coup for republicans, who could then present (and treat them) them as an occupying force.  The government put them in chiefly to avoid the indignity of having UN peacekeepers, and then could not withdraw them, because that would be yet another political coup for the republicans.

 

Recently I saw contemporary 70s footage of (english) troops being interviewed in the province.  Many seemed bewildered about the whole thing.  

 

One admitted it was hard not to take sides, given the differences in how they were treated.  "What do you think of Catholics?" the interviewer asked him.  "I am a Catholic" he said.  "But I don't like the northern Irish ones very much".

 

Another guy was very astute and stated using the Army was misguided and a political solution was needed.  He noted that the society was gravely unequal (deliberately so) and that it would need to be more equal before peace would return.  That was true, and it must have made his day all the worse to know that him risking his life daily was ultimately fruitless in terms of ending the violence and division.

 

All certainly true and I know many people who were in the army in Northern Ireland. 

Doesn't alter the fact that going right back to the original plantation in the 1700s, it has been quite literal hunnish behaviour.

 

In the context of the reply and original post though.  Citing service in Northern Ireland as a counterpoint to being a "coward and hun" is not particularly effective. 

 

Certainly a good argument against being called a coward, but not against being called a hun; that was all.

[fatjim]

Let's face it most people who join the army or police are the kind of people that shouldn't be allowed to join the army or police.

[Old manny]

All certainly true and I know many people who were in the army in Northern Ireland. 

Doesn't alter the fact that going right back to the original plantation in the 1700s, it has been quite literal hunnish behaviour.

 

In the context of the reply and original post though.  Citing service in Northern Ireland as a counterpoint to being a "coward and hun" is not particularly effective. 

 

Certainly a good argument against being called a coward, but not against being called a hun; that was all.

The Protestant plantation was begun by James VI in 1606 when he packed off the border troublemakers to Ulster and not the 1700s as you state. If you can't even get that basic fact right it is hard to take your hun accusation seriously. Childish in the extreme.

[Old manny]

Confirmed.

 

Utterly fucking clueless.

 

You brought up the old "imperialist masters" cliché and I simply responded that Scotland played a full part in the Empire building project. If it is your contention that this is not the case then I await your response with baited breath.

[Clydeside_Sheep]

I'm not convinced we will see a 2nd referendum, at least not in the near future.

 

Well, I had no sooner posted this, than Sturgeon is in the papers saying she will release a timetable for a 2nd referendum "very soon".

 

Maybe they think the scaremongering and initial lack of clarity around brexit will help them?

 

Or maybe the timetable will be a bodge job, something like "after brexit, but before the sun burns itself out".

[Clydeside_Sheep]

You brought up the old "imperialist masters" cliché and I simply responded that Scotland played a full part in the Empire building project. If it is your contention that this is not the case then I await your response with baited breath.

 

Too right, a full and prominent part.  Scotland did very well out of the Empire, just as it continues to do well out of the Union.

[caledonia]

Too right, a full and prominent part. Scotland did very well out of the Empire, just as it continues to do well out of the Union.

Clueless

[maryhilldon]

Too right, a full and prominent part. Scotland did very well out of the Empire, just as it continues to do well out of the Union.

Look around man, Scotland's a fuckin dump.

[zander]

Look around man, Scotland's a fuckin dump.

Too many skivers (SNP types) and not enough strivers bringing this country down.

[muttonhumper]

You brought up the old "imperialist masters" cliché and I simply responded that Scotland played a full part in the Empire building project. If it is your contention that this is not the case then I await your response with baited breath.

 

Not by choice.

 

Unfortunately.

 

Not sure why you hate Scotland, the country of your birth*, so much?

 

Scotland was forced and blackmailed into this union.

This was not the choice of our people.

To this day, our resources both natural, and financial are stripped for fuck all in return but absolute contempt from the fuckwits in control at Westminster.

Every year we give them every penny raised here and get half at most back.

 

Out identity as a nation is perpetually and deliberately ravaged as a consequence of being ruled by a foreign neighbour.

It's not normal. Yet you glory in it.

 

Is it not about time you got up off your knees?

 

Who the fuck are you to promote keeping our country under the rule of another nation.

I'd say that was the sort of behaviour that would warrant the knocking of one's teeth right down the back of one's throat. To use you own words...

 

If you love English rule so much, why don't you fuck off down there?

Leave us to sort our own country out for ourselves.

 

You pathetic, boot licking, subservient fuck nugget.

 

 

*TBC

[Old manny]

Not by choice.

 

Unfortunately.

 

Not sure why you hate Scotland, the country of your birth*, so much?

 

Scotland was forced and blackmailed into this union.

This was not the choice of our people.

To this day, our resources both natural, and financial are stripped for fuck all in return but absolute contempt from the fuckwits in control at Westminster.

Every year we give them every penny raised here and get half at most back.

 

Out identity as a nation is perpetually and deliberately ravaged as a consequence of being ruled by a foreign neighbour.

It's not normal. Yet you glory in it.

 

Is it not about time you got up off your knees?

I'd say that was the sort of behaviour that would warrant the knocking of one's teeth right down the back of one's throat. To use you own words...

 

 

If you love English rule so much, why don't you fuck off down there?

Leave us to sort our own country out for ourselves.

 

You pathetic, boot licking, subservient fuck nugget.

 

 

*TBC

What a fucking plank.

 

 

I'd say that was the sort of behaviour that would warrant the knocking of one's teeth right down the back of one's throat. To use you own words...

 

Don't recall threatening anyone so if you can just show me where I said that and if you can't it just reveals you for the windbag you are.

 

If you love English rule so much, why don't you fuck off down there?

Leave us to sort our own country out for ourselves.

 

I don't, but who in their right mind would swap one political overlord for 27? As I have already said in this thread I have no inherent objection to Scottish independence provided we truly went our own way and don't jump out of the frying pan straight into the fire. Our food products, whisky industry, technological knowhow and carbon neutral technology are first class and we can make our own way in the world without tying ourselves to anyone's apron strings.

 

Scotland was forced and blackmailed into this union

 

As I said before the Darien adventure had bankrupted the country and the Merchants, shopkeepers, tradesmen etc who had lost everything tacitly supported Hamilton and his cronies as the Union deal saw them get their money back. Try to remember that 18th century Scotland was hardly a democracy, but the fact is the 1707 settlement,  even though it meant the "end of an auld sang",saved us from decades of absolute financial disaster.

 

 

If you love English rule so much, why don't you fuck off down there?

Leave us to sort our own country out for ourselves.

 

You pathetic, boot licking, subservient fuck nugget.

 

Act your age min nae your shoe size and we can continue this debate in a civil manner. If not do one.

[muttonhumper]

Fuck me, what a thick cunt.

 

Go fuck yourself you retarded piece of shit.

Preferably to here, with like "minded" scumbags.

https://www.followfollow.com/forum/

[Old manny]

Fuck me, what a thick cunt.

 

Go fuck yourself you retarded piece of shit.

 

Preferably to here, with like "minded" scumbags.

 

https://www.followfollow.com/forum/

LOL

 

It seems I have managed to get right up your nose. Nothing to say on the points I have made or are you just going to keep blustering on like an old wifie who has lost her pension money at the Bingo?

[muttonhumper]

LOL

 

It seems I have managed to get up your nose. Nothing to say on the points I have made or are just going to keep blustering on like an old wifie?

 

You don't have any points worth commenting on, you stupid cunt.

The last three pages of this thread underline this.

 

Just typical brainwashed drivel regurgitated from Britnat propaganda designed to garner support from the lame of thinking such as yourself.

 

Get off your knees you pathetic grovelling arsehole.

 

I have fuck all but contempt for you and your like.

[Old manny]

You don't have any points worth commenting on, you stupid cunt.

The last three pages of this thread underline this.

 

Just typical brainwashed drivel regurgitated from Britnat propaganda designed to garner support from the lame of thinking such as yourself.

 

Get off your knees you pathetic grovelling arsehole.

 

I have fuck all but contempt for you and your like.

Fair enough sunshine.

[manboobs109]

Feel a bit guilty for all this now. Good cunt is Old Manny.

[Fridge]

 

Fuck me, what a thick cunt.

 

Go fuck yourself you retarded piece of shit.

 

Fuck sake MH, roid club on a Tuesday night! Were you back to work today or something?

[Old manny]

Feel a bit guilty for all this now. Good cunt is Old Manny.

 

You been at the cherry brandy again?

[manboobs109]

Port and stilton man. Still munching and drinking Christmas shit.

[Bluto10]

best not to take any interest in politics IMO

 

putting faith in people (politicians) who generally don’t deliver is for the gullible IYAM

 

look after yourself and treat others with respect, esp those less fortunate than yourself, is my mantra

[SheepieBaaBaa]

The Protestant plantation was begun by James VI in 1606 when he packed off the border troublemakers to Ulster and not the 1700s as you state. If you can't even get that basic fact right it is hard to take your hun accusation seriously. Childish in the extreme.

You know what, you stupid pedantic cunt. I have been generally nice and respectful of your idiotic opinions up to now, despite you being an ignorant narrow minded fuck, but now I truly understand that you are a prick.

 

Oh no....I got a date wrong....who gives a fuck? Only stupid intellectually challenged fuckwits like you.

 

Cant engage on an intellectual/theoretical level so revert to irrelevant pedantry.

 

On the basis that I typed 1700s rather than 17th century by mistake you contend that the plantation of Ulster us not a hun/blue nose/orange order/british loyalist action.....you complete imbecile.

 

Why don't you stick to reading your book of mythology and endorsing child molestation and convenient religious double standards? you clearly have no reasoning ability....which explains the religious thing admitedly.

 

Fucking arse wipe.

[caledonia]

What a fucking plank.

 

 

I'd say that was the sort of behaviour that would warrant the knocking of one's teeth right down the back of one's throat. To use you own words...

 

Don't recall threatening anyone so if you can just show me where I said that and if you can't it just reveals you for the windbag you are.

 

If you love English rule so much, why don't you fuck off down there?

Leave us to sort our own country out for ourselves.

 

I don't, but who in their right mind would swap one political overlord for 27? As I have already said in this thread I have no inherent objection to Scottish independence provided we truly went our own way and don't jump out of the frying pan straight into the fire. Our food products, whisky industry, technological knowhow and carbon neutral technology are first class and we can make our own way in the world without tying ourselves to anyone's apron strings.

 

Scotland was forced and blackmailed into this union

 

As I said before the Darien adventure had bankrupted the country and the Merchants, shopkeepers, tradesmen etc who had lost everything tacitly supported Hamilton and his cronies as the Union deal saw them get their money back. Try to remember that 18th century Scotland was hardly a democracy, but the fact is the 1707 settlement, even though it meant the "end of an auld sang",saved us from decades of absolute financial disaster.

 

 

If you love English rule so much, why don't you fuck off down there?

Leave us to sort our own country out for ourselves.

 

You pathetic, boot licking, subservient fuck nugget.

 

Act your age min nae your shoe size and we can continue this debate in a civil manner. If not do one.

Your thicker than i thought in the uk Scotland gets NO SAY

 

But with Europe we at least get most of the say look at Ireland and brexit or are you as brainwashed or braindead to notice

 

[Old manny]

You know what, you stupid pedantic cunt. I have been generally nice and respectful of your idiotic opinions up to now, despite you being an ignorant narrow minded fuck, but now I truly understand that you are a prick.

 

Oh no....I got a date wrong....who gives a fuck? Only stupid intellectually challenged fuckwits like you.

 

Cant engage on an intellectual/theoretical level so revert to irrelevant pedantry.

 

On the basis that I typed 1700s rather than 17th century by mistake you contend that the plantation of Ulster us not a hun/blue nose/orange order/british loyalist action.....you complete imbecile.

 

Why don't you stick to reading your book of mythology and endorsing child molestation and convenient religious double standards? you clearly have no reasoning ability....which explains the religious thing admitedly.

 

Fucking arse wipe.

You called me a hun you simple minded cunt so as far as I am concerned you are fair game.

[Old manny]

Your thicker than i thought in the uk Scotland gets NO SAY

 

But with Europe we at least get most of the say look at Ireland and brexit or are you as brainwashed or braindead to notice

Aye I did notice and I also noticed what happened to Greece, or had you forgotten?

[SheepieBaaBaa]

You called me a hun you simple minded cunt so as far as I am concerned you are fair game.

Sign in witb the wrong i.d. did you?

 

I didnt call you a hun...I simply respectfully (and I even used that word) pointed out that serving in her majesty's forces in Ulster supporting a centuries old protestant loyalist presence is not a refutation of the accusaton of being a hun...an accusation which was not made by me.

 

You stated that this meant that you were not a coward or a hun.

 

I simply pointed out that your military service could certainly be used as evidence that you are, or were not a coward, but it is of no evidenciary value in proving that you are not a hun, and if anything could be used to suggest otherwise.

[Old manny]

Sign in witb the wrong i.d. did you?

 

I didnt call you a hun...I simply respectfully (and I even used that word) pointed out that serving in her majesty's forces in Ulster supporting a centuries old protestant loyalist presence is not a refutation of the accusaton of being a hun...an accusation which was not made by me.

 

You stated that this meant that you were not a coward or a hun.

 

I simply pointed out that your military service could certainly be used as evidence that you are, or were not a coward, but it is of no evidenciary value in proving that you are not a hun, and if anything could be used to suggest otherwise.

No mate, if you read my post again carefully my argument for not being a hun was that I have been going to Pittodrie since you were in your nappies. You obviously accept that being labelled as a hun is about the worst insult that can be bandied about on here and in hindsight I accept you were jesting. So lets leave it at that and accept each other as fellow Dandies even though I am a "pedantic" cunt.

[Redforever86]

No mate, if you read my post again carefully my argument for not being a hun was that I have been going to Pittodrie since you were in your nappies. You obviously accept that being labelled as a hun is about the worst insult that can be bandied about on here and in hindsight I accept you were jesting. So lets leave it at that and accept each other as fellow Dandies even though I am a "pedantic" cunt.

 

Shut up you hun.