Coronavirus

[Ke1t]

9 minutes ago, Ramandu said:

I'm not saying Caprice is particularly wise. She may be an idiot or a genius, I've no idea, and don't really care. I'm saying that public experts are very fallible. And they often speak with an authority and confidence they haven't earned. 

How do you tell a real expert from a blagger? How do you tell if someone is speaking outside of their area of expertise? Saying "just trust the guy with letters after his name" isn't much better than saying "don't trust any experts".

I've no idea why anyone would think ex-model Caprice could talk with knowledge or authority on Coronavirus... it makes absolutely no fucking sense to me. 

"Here's a bird with a background in modeling, and she's going to talk about something she has no education or background in. She did, however, read something in the paper, so we're going to stick her in front of a camera, for a national audience,  to try talking down to someone who spent 8 years of their life studying the subject."

And later, we're going to have a Chinese government spokesman on to talk about the world of modeling because he once read Cosmopolitan. 

It pisses me off and baffles me in equal fucking measure. 

Regardless...

'Experts' are people who have studied a specific subject for a prolonged period of time, and have the academic credentials to show they understand what they're talking about. This is why it's important to have them on our tellies discussing these kinds of things, rather than schmucks like me, you, or Caprice who have no idea what the fuck we're talking about when it comes to stuff like pandemics. 

How do we determine who we believe?

That's a different matter, but if it came out in the course of a debate about, say, climate change, that one of the scientists taking part in the debate was being paid millions by Exxon to deny climate change then that might be a significant hit to their credibility, and you might go... "Waaaaait a minute...." 

 

 

[Poodler]

Portugal aff the green list

 

is war torn Israel still on it? 

[Ramandu]

24 minutes ago, Ke1t said:

I've no idea why anyone would think ex-model Caprice could talk with knowledge or authority on Coronavirus... it makes absolutely no fucking sense to me. 

"Here's a bird with a background in modeling, and she's going to talk about something she has no education or background in. She did, however, read something in the paper, so we're going to stick her in front of a camera, for a national audience,  to try talking down to someone who spent 8 years of their life studying the subject."

And later, we're going to have a Chinese government spokesman on to talk about the world of modeling because he once read Cosmopolitan. 

It pisses me off and baffles me in equal fucking measure. 

Regardless...

'Experts' are people who have studied a specific subject for a prolonged period of time, and have the academic credentials to show they understand what they're talking about. This is why it's important to have them on our tellies discussing these kinds of things, rather than schmucks like me, you, or Caprice who have no idea what the fuck we're talking about when it comes to stuff like pandemics. 

How do we determine who we believe?

That's a different matter, but if it came out in the course of a debate about, say, climate change, that one of the scientists taking part in the debate was being paid millions by Exxon to deny climate change then that might be a significant hit to their credibility, and you might go... "Waaaaait a minute...." 

I'm with you getting annoyed at random people on TV talking about things they have no knowledge about. Caprice shouldn't be on TV talking about public health. 

But a public "expert" who speaks outside their domain can be worse. I've spent plenty time at university, and I think that's worth something, but it means nothing when I speak confidently outside my domain. There are biases which are worse for educated people*, and I genuinely believe that some parts of university make people more stupid.

Anyway, my point was more that in the UK (and plenty other places) there have been significant failures from public health experts.

 

* Not me obviously. Only other people are biased.

[Ke1t]

1 hour ago, Ramandu said:

I'm with you getting annoyed at random people on TV talking about things they have no knowledge about. Caprice shouldn't be on TV talking about public health. 

But a public "expert" who speaks outside their domain can be worse. I've spent plenty time at university, and I think that's worth something, but it means nothing when I speak confidently outside my domain. There are biases which are worse for educated people*, and I genuinely believe that some parts of university make people more stupid.

Anyway, my point was more that in the UK (and plenty other places) there have been significant failures from public health experts.

 

* Not me obviously. Only other people are biased.

I think most of the failures have come from politicians trying to 'interpret' what they're being told by the experts in a way that is politically expedient at the time, rather than following the advice of those in the field. 

Fauci has basically said that he was more or less gagged by the Trump administration, while they did whatever they felt benefited them, regardless of repercussions at a later time. Unfortunately a later time always arrives.

I don't know much of the situation in the UK, but I suspect Bojo took much the same philosophical route as Trump, inasmuch as 'policy' was a haphazard amalgam of bare minimum safety measures, crossed fingers, and pandering to the public. The result of which was an avoidable clusterfuck that politicians now want to blame on the health experts. 

 

[manboobs109]

Remember the police screaming "your killing people" at cunts out for a walk.

 

[Fridge]

35 minutes ago, Ke1t said:

I think most of the failures have come from politicians trying to 'interpret' what they're being told by the experts in a way that is politically expedient at the time, rather than following the advice of those in the field. 

Fauci has basically said that he was more or less gagged by the Trump administration, while they did whatever they felt benefited them, regardless of repercussions at a later time. Unfortunately a later time always arrives.

I don't know much of the situation in the UK, but I suspect Bojo took much the same philosophical route as Trump, inasmuch as 'policy' was a haphazard amalgam of bare minimum safety measures, crossed fingers, and pandering to the public. The result of which was an avoidable clusterfuck that politicians now want to blame on the health experts. 

 

This is undoubtedly a factor, I do think that all politicians were vote seeking to an extent when it should have been everyone standing together and saying fuck politics it’s folks life’s.

Bojo, fair play happy days now with the vaccines over the rest of Europe but was far too lenient at the start.

Sturgeon doing exactly the opposite of Bojo whenever she had a chance. Fair play for being stricter at the start and stamping down on the Aberdeen debacle, we deserved it. She is strict on Glasgow now but I doubt it would have been the case pre election.

[Ke1t]

19 minutes ago, manboobs109 said:

Remember the police screaming "your killing people" at cunts out for a walk.

 

Nothing against coppers, but its high fucking time they were replaced by something cleverer, like robots or dogs. 

[manboobs109]

16 minutes ago, Bad_Mobby said:

Pubs nae open in Dundee yet? 

You'll get a week off man I'm away my holidays the morn.

[manboobs109]

1 minute ago, Ke1t said:

Nothing against coppers, but its high fucking time they were replaced by something cleverer, like robots or dogs. 

I agree. Fucking bunch of cunts. I'd take all their motors away, that'd keep the cunts on their toes, having to run everywhere.

[Bluto10]

6 minutes ago, Ke1t said:

Nothing against coppers, but its high fucking time they were replaced by something cleverer, like robots or dogs. 

not seen Robicop min? we’ve had them since the 80s

[Bluto10]

3 minutes ago, manboobs109 said:

I agree. Fucking bunch of cunts. I'd take all their motors away, that'd keep the cunts on their toes, having to run everywhere.

remember you had to be tall, fit, perfect sighted etc to be one (apparently)

 

lol

[Ramandu]

25 minutes ago, Ke1t said:

I think most of the failures have come from politicians trying to 'interpret' what they're being told by the experts in a way that is politically expedient at the time, rather than following the advice of those in the field. 

Fauci has basically said that he was more or less gagged by the Trump administration, while they did whatever they felt benefited them, regardless of repercussions at a later time. Unfortunately a later time always arrives.

I don't know much of the situation in the UK, but I suspect Bojo took much the same philosophical route as Trump, inasmuch as 'policy' was a haphazard amalgam of bare minimum safety measures, crossed fingers, and pandering to the public. The result of which was an avoidable clusterfuck that politicians now want to blame on the health experts. 

 

Don't know much about the US side, but that's really not my understanding of the UK response. Here the politicians (both Westminster and Holyrood) have largely done what they were told by public health advisors. 

There's a Twitter account which is dedicated to retweeting things people were saying exactly a year ago, politicians, pundits and advisors. It was pretty damning between Feb-April (@YearCovid).

I'm not arguing that we should ignore all experts, or any weird conspiracy theory about covid. I'm saying that public health performed very poorly during the pandemic, which happens to be one of the few instances where the feedback loop is short enough to test predictions.

[Don Fonte]

1 hour ago, manboobs109 said:

You'll get a week off man I'm away my holidays the morn.

Where you heading Moobster?

[Poodler]

1 hour ago, manboobs109 said:

You'll get a week off man I'm away my holidays the morn.

Arbroath? 

[manboobs109]

3 minutes ago, Don Fonte said:

Where you heading Moobster?

Wales. One of those Haven places with shit for the nipper.

[manboobs109]

5 minutes ago, Poodler said:

Arbroath? 

Arbroaths class. Dunno if I could handle a week though.

[Poodler]

1 minute ago, manboobs109 said:

Wales. One of those Haven places with shit for the nipper.

No way are you going abroad, you hypocritical racist!

[Don Fonte]

2 minutes ago, manboobs109 said:

Wales. One of those Haven places with shit for the nipper.

Sheep shagging cunt 

[daytripping]

5 hours ago, Ke1t said:

The problem comes when an appeal to authority fallacy is used to attempt  bolster an argument, as in the case of ex-model Caprice here. 

When she references an article by 'Wu's spokesperson'*, she's simply parroting something she heard with no apparent understanding of anything beyond what she read by a single individual (an expert)... and as a spokesperson for (presumably) the nation of the Virus' origin it would be reasonable to assume that any commentary coming from that source (authoritarian China) would be heavily filtered and edited to fit a very specific narrative. 

I can cite a single 'expert' who will tell you that Climate Change is a Liberal hoax, perpetrated by scientists who simply use the spectre of a dying planet to get more grants. It's best to understand where that single expert is coming from... and it's usually from a place where they're being funded by oil companies. 

Roger Cohen, by all accounts a brilliant scientist and an 'expert' on climate, spent a lot of his time denying that Climate change was a thing. You could cite him all day long as an expert. He was also being funded by Exxon to deny Climate Change.  He was also in a minority of 1 or 2 percent of scientists who denied climate change. 

Ex-model Caprice having a "quote from an expert" is no persuasive argument, particularly when that single expert is (presumably) a member of the Chinese government, and not actually an expert but a spokesperson for someone called 'Wu'. 

I'd say Caprice isn't showing any understanding at all... she's repeating a thing she read from a single source, and a pretty dubious source at that. 

She repeatedly emphasises how "This is a spokesperson from Wu."

Okay, Caprice, but so what?  

 

*Presumably either Chinese Vice Premier Wu or Chinese Health Minister Wu. 

Caprice in hindsight made an utter arse of the "expert", she was correct and the expert was a dunce.

It's the experts that have got us into this mess, fucking about with viruses in labs to see how they could improve and cure them, its been a shit show.

I'll stick to pretty girls for advice in the future, the smart cunts got a little too smart.

[tutankamun]

Michael Gove may have actually been very prescient when he said ‘Britain has had enough of experts’.

He said this pre-pandemic, referring to Brexit, however Covid has highlighted that experts quite often contradict one another. Science is not exact, especially new science.

[Ke1t]

6 minutes ago, tutankamun said:

Michael Gove may have actually been very prescient when he said ‘Britain has had enough of experts’.

He said this pre-pandemic, referring to Brexit, however Covid has highlighted that experts quite often contradict one another. Science is not exact, especially new science.

That was probably one of the worst things I think I've heard a modern day politician say and get away with. 

 

[Ke1t]

46 minutes ago, daytripping said:

Caprice in hindsight made an utter arse of the "expert", she was correct and the expert was a dunce.

It's the experts that have got us into this mess, fucking about with viruses in labs to see how they could improve and cure them, its been a shit show.

I'll stick to pretty girls for advice in the future, the smart cunts got a little too smart.

Not in that clip she didn't... is there another part of that show that I haven't seen?

[frankie_mac's_4]

12 minutes ago, tutankamun said:

Science is not exact

Jesus fucking wept 

[tutankamun]

24 minutes ago, Ke1t said:

That was probably one of the worst things I think I've heard a modern day politician say and get away with. 

 

It was mental. But some of these Covid experts are on the payroll.

[tutankamun]

22 minutes ago, frankie_mac's_4 said:

Jesus fucking wept 

Of course it’s not, science evolves as we do. It’s an iterative process.

Edit: I mean our understanding of science 

[daytripping]

28 minutes ago, Ke1t said:

Not in that clip she didn't... is there another part of that show that I haven't seen?

She said masks and social distancing works, the expert said they didn't. She was way ahead of the expert advice.

[frankie_mac's_4]

4 minutes ago, tutankamun said:

Of course it’s not, science evolves as we do. It’s an iterative process.

Edit: I mean our understanding of science 

Goan read up on what the definition of the word science is

[tutankamun]

Is the Nepal variant a real thing or is the British government colluding with the Daily Fail for some reason?

[tutankamun]

5 minutes ago, frankie_mac's_4 said:

Goan read up on what the definition of the word science is

“Science is the pursuit and application of knowledge and understanding of the natural and social world following a systematic methodology based on evidence”

What’s your point?

[frankie_mac's_4]

That it's anything but inexact