The Boofon Posted January 12, 2022 Share Posted January 12, 2022 30 minutes ago, NEM said: 7 day case rate per 100k population has went from England having the highest of the 4 nations pre restrictions to the lowest now so aye it's fair to say they've failed. Maybe they've passed the peak and we haven't? Link to comment
Guest Posted January 12, 2022 Share Posted January 12, 2022 33 minutes ago, NEM said: 7 day case rate per 100k population has went from England having the highest of the 4 nations pre restrictions to the lowest now so aye it's fair to say they've failed. But I thought focusing on cases was futile, and what mattered was whether or not they led to hospitalisations/deaths? Link to comment
NEM Posted January 12, 2022 Share Posted January 12, 2022 11 minutes ago, ConsiCanBoogie1903 said: But I thought focusing on cases was futile, and what mattered was whether or not they led to hospitalisations/deaths? ...,and how do restrictions impact that if they don't reduce case numbers? 15 minutes ago, The Boofon said: Maybe they've passed the peak and we haven't? Maybe. Or maybe forcing folk into bars etc to watch football rather than outdoors is a stupid idea Link to comment
The Boofon Posted January 12, 2022 Share Posted January 12, 2022 11 minutes ago, ConsiCanBoogie1903 said: But I thought focusing on cases was futile, and what mattered was whether or not they led to hospitalisations/deaths? Ooooof. Hud at. Link to comment
NEM Posted January 12, 2022 Share Posted January 12, 2022 2 minutes ago, The Boofon said: Ooooof. Hud at. 3 minutes ago, NEM said: ...,and how do restrictions impact that if they don't reduce case numbers? Link to comment
Guest Posted January 12, 2022 Share Posted January 12, 2022 1 minute ago, NEM said: ...,and how do restrictions impact that if they don't reduce case numbers? Maybe. Or maybe forcing folk into bars etc to watch football rather than outdoors is a stupid idea How would you know if they did/didn't reduce case numbers? Without them, more might've been infected, they might not have been. There is not a predetermined number of acceptable cases to deem restrictions a failure, there's no way of knowing if it did/did not cause less or more cases. Only speculation. I didn't agree with the restrictions but suggesting it's a 'failure' without anything to compare it to, is silly, IMO. If the restrictions had caused a considerable rise in deaths/hospitalisations, you could probably surmise they were a failure. Just because the virus continued to spread doesn't necessarily mean it was, though. As you rightly like to point out, 'it'll spread anyway.' Link to comment
Tommy Posted January 12, 2022 Share Posted January 12, 2022 50 minutes ago, NEM said: 7 day case rate per 100k population has went from England having the highest of the 4 nations pre restrictions to the lowest now so aye it's fair to say they've failed. Was there not a serious shortage of LFT’s in England so less tests taken would make their figures look better. Link to comment
NEM Posted January 12, 2022 Share Posted January 12, 2022 1 minute ago, ConsiCanBoogie1903 said: How would you know if they did/didn't reduce case numbers? Without them, more might've been infected, they might not have been. There is not a predetermined number of acceptable cases to deem restrictions a failure, there's no way of knowing if it did/did not cause less or more cases. Only speculation. I didn't agree with the restrictions but suggesting it's a 'failure' without anything to compare it to, is silly, IMO. If the restrictions had caused a considerable rise in deaths/hospitalisations, you could probably surmise they were a failure. Just because the virus continued to spread doesn't necessarily mean it was, though. As you rightly like to point out, 'it'll spread anyway.' But we do - we can compare it to our neighbours who didn't impose the same ridiculous restrictions. 52 minutes ago, NEM said: 7 day case rate per 100k population has went from England having the highest of the 4 nations pre restrictions to the lowest now so aye it's fair to say they've failed. Link to comment
NEM Posted January 12, 2022 Share Posted January 12, 2022 5 minutes ago, Tommy said: Was there not a serious shortage of LFT’s in England so less tests taken would make their figures look better. Unlikely as we don't include them up here anyway according to this Are lateral flow test results included in headline Covid-19 case figures? - Full Fact "The headline case numbers for Wales and Scotland do not currently include reported positive lateral flow test results, although data on this is available elsewhere." Link to comment
Guest Posted January 12, 2022 Share Posted January 12, 2022 56 minutes ago, NEM said: But we do - we can compare it to our neighbours who didn't impose the same ridiculous restrictions. A nation totally differing in size, type of population, and arguably, mindset. Obviously it's looked at on a per capita basis but that doesn't negate all the differing factors. You don't know that the cases would've been less without restrictions, you can't know that, it's hypothetical. Im surprised to see you make an argument for failure of policy on the basis of cases, considering you've slammed them for basing policy around case rises and not hospitalisations etc. Hospitalisations etc that we don't have the numbers for yet over this period (I don't think.) Again I disagree with the restrictions I just don't think anyone can categorically state the restrictions as a "failure." Link to comment
Guest Posted January 12, 2022 Share Posted January 12, 2022 1 hour ago, NEM said: ...,and how do restrictions impact that if they don't reduce case numbers? Maybe. Or maybe forcing folk into bars etc to watch football rather than outdoors is a stupid idea Maybe they did? Unless all 6,000,000 odd folk in Scotland got infected, there's no feasible way of knowing that for sure. You can only loosely compare to other nations. That won't ever paint a full picture though as there are so many social, economic and cultural factors that tie into everything. Link to comment
NEM Posted January 12, 2022 Share Posted January 12, 2022 34 minutes ago, ConsiCanBoogie1903 said: A nation totally differing in size, type of population, and arguably, mindset. Obviously it's looked at on a per capita basis but that doesn't negate all the differing factors. You don't know that the cases would've been less without restrictions, you can't know that, it's hypothetical. Im surprised to see you make an argument for failure of policy on the basis of cases, considering you've slammed them for basing policy around case rises and not hospitalisations etc. Hospitalisations etc that we don't have the numbers for yet over this period (I don't think.) Again I disagree with the restrictions I just don't think anyone can categorically state the restrictions as a "failure." A nation more densely populated ergo should have higher cases? Yes it's hypothetical but given that's all we've to go on it's reasonable to use as a guide. I've slammed them for their ridiculous restrictions, restrictions they imposed in a futile attempt to lower case numbers. Link to comment
NEM Posted January 12, 2022 Share Posted January 12, 2022 34 minutes ago, ConsiCanBoogie1903 said: Maybe they did? Unless all 6,000,000 odd folk in Scotland got infected, there's no feasible way of knowing that for sure. You can only loosely compare to other nations. That won't ever paint a full picture though as there are so many social, economic and cultural factors that tie into everything. So how do you suggest measuring the success of the restrictions? Link to comment
Reed or deed Posted January 12, 2022 Share Posted January 12, 2022 8 minutes ago, NEM said: So how do you suggest measuring the success of the restrictions? On a scale of how angry they make you. ? Link to comment
NEM Posted January 12, 2022 Share Posted January 12, 2022 3 minutes ago, Reed or deed said: On a scale of how angry they make you. ? Were you happy with them like? ? Link to comment
Parklife Posted January 12, 2022 Share Posted January 12, 2022 Credit has to go to the SPFL and the clubs for bringing the winter break forward, meaning only one game had to take place without full crowds. Not often they're praised but credit where it's due. 2 Link to comment
Reed or deed Posted January 12, 2022 Share Posted January 12, 2022 16 minutes ago, NEM said: Were you happy with them like? ? I don’t give a flying fuck. Love being able to work from home ? Can see why folk would be upset by them at the same time like. Link to comment
Dr_Manhattan Posted January 12, 2022 Share Posted January 12, 2022 3 hours ago, NEM said: So how do you suggest measuring the success of the restrictions? You can't. Same way you can't say that an unvaxxed individual who dies would have survived if they'd been vaxxed. You have no idea what result the alternative course of action would have produced. 1 Link to comment
Guest Posted January 12, 2022 Share Posted January 12, 2022 5 hours ago, NEM said: So how do you suggest measuring the success of the restrictions? You can't really, hence why it's bullshit. Link to comment
NEM Posted January 12, 2022 Share Posted January 12, 2022 1 hour ago, ConsiCanBoogie1903 said: You can't really, hence why it's bullshit. Lol so you’d be fine for sturgeon to carry on with the bullshit, there’s no way of telling if they work! Wise up min ? 1 Link to comment
Guest Posted January 12, 2022 Share Posted January 12, 2022 1 hour ago, NEM said: Lol so you’d be fine for sturgeon to carry on with the bullshit, there’s no way of telling if they work! Wise up min ? No? I've said I don't agree with the restrictions? Yeah said that twice. My only assertion is you can't say it's a definitive failure. Read my posts min ? Link to comment
NEM Posted January 12, 2022 Share Posted January 12, 2022 1 minute ago, ConsiCanBoogie1903 said: No? I've said I don't agree with the restrictions? Yeah said that twice. My only assertion is you can't say it's a definitive failure. Read my posts min ? On what grounds do you disagree with them then if you can’t tell whether they’ve worked or not? ? Link to comment
Guest Posted January 12, 2022 Share Posted January 12, 2022 2 minutes ago, NEM said: On what grounds do you disagree with them then if you can’t tell whether they’ve worked or not? ? On the grounds that plenty are vaccinated and it's a weak variant by all accounts. As you rightly say all the time, people will get it regardless. Link to comment
Dr_Manhattan Posted January 12, 2022 Share Posted January 12, 2022 3 minutes ago, NEM said: On what grounds do you disagree with them then if you can’t tell whether they’ve worked or not? ? Ooo, ooo, I know sir, me, me! Because they're a massive overreach of government authority and the sort of thing you see from tyrannical dictatorships. 2 Link to comment
NEM Posted January 12, 2022 Share Posted January 12, 2022 1 minute ago, Dr_Manhattan said: Ooo, ooo, I know sir, me, me! Because they're a massive overreach of government authority and the sort of thing you see from tyrannical dictatorships. We have a winner ? Link to comment
maryhilldon Posted January 12, 2022 Share Posted January 12, 2022 8 hours ago, Reed or deed said: I don’t give a flying fuck. You absolutely do, you're constantly posting about the subject. You're one of the most vocal , even advocating the non-vaxed get refused hospital treatment. But also bragging about boozing at a packed golf club during lockdown. I'll say it again, you're a dimwit. 2 Link to comment
Poodler Posted January 12, 2022 Share Posted January 12, 2022 2 minutes ago, maryhilldon said: You absolutely do, you're constantly posting about the subject. You're one of the most vocal , even advocating the non-vaxed get refused hospital treatment. But also bragging about boozing at a packed golf club during lockdown. I'll say it again, you're a dimwit. You’re a dickhead but you’re right here Link to comment
maryhilldon Posted January 12, 2022 Share Posted January 12, 2022 2 minutes ago, Poodler said: You’re a dickhead but you’re right here Thanks, I think. 1 Link to comment
davieb Posted January 12, 2022 Share Posted January 12, 2022 2 hours ago, Dr_Manhattan said: Ooo, ooo, I know sir, me, me! Because they're a massive overreach of government authority and the sort of thing you see from tyrannical dictatorships. ? Link to comment
maryhilldon Posted January 13, 2022 Share Posted January 13, 2022 2 hours ago, Dr_Manhattan said: tyrannical dictatorships. Prefer Diplodocus. Link to comment
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