Durrant Dived Posted September 14, 2021 Share Posted September 14, 2021 10 minutes ago, afc1903mad said: Out of interest, would anyone accept £5M maybe with a sell on) with a loan back for the season? His contract runs until 2024 so that is the absolute minimum we should be entertaining. We should be looking at doubling his wage and getting another year or 2 out of him though. Link to comment
afc1903mad Posted September 14, 2021 Share Posted September 14, 2021 4 minutes ago, Durrant Dived said: His contract runs until 2024 so that is the absolute minimum we should be entertaining. We should be looking at doubling his wage and getting another year or 2 out of him though. 2024 is practically just 2 1/2 years away. Its not that long so the value will likely only diminish unless we get him to extend. Link to comment
Ten Caat Posted September 14, 2021 Share Posted September 14, 2021 7 minutes ago, afc1903mad said: Out of interest, would anyone accept £5M maybe with a sell on) with a loan back for the season? Yes.......but I'm not sure it would be possible to do it right now. The transfer window is closed, there's nothing to stop any club buying a player outwith a window but they cannot be registered as a player until the next window opens, So if Everton bought him, his registration with us would end, but they couldn't register him with the English FA and they couldn't loan him back to us as we couldn't register the loan back until January. I think....(not sure if there are any loopholes to circumvent this) Right now he's pure potential. his ceiling is high but there are always a number of factors that come into play that could prevent him from reaching it. £5m plus a loan back for the rest of the season is a deal that would suit all parties. However in reality, if there's any truth in these Everton rumours, I doubt they'd be offering more than £1.5 - 2m at most. And their English arrogance and sense of entitlement would make them think we are bound to accept. Link to comment
thurso Posted September 14, 2021 Share Posted September 14, 2021 He’s as good if not better than both Patterson and the wee fellow who left Celtic for the German team both were quoted of being about £10 million. So that’s what we should be aiming for 1 Link to comment
aberdeen1970 Posted September 14, 2021 Share Posted September 14, 2021 14 minutes ago, afc1903mad said: 2024 is practically just 2 1/2 years away. Its not that long so the value will likely only diminish unless we get him to extend. It's ages away min. The best part of three years. Behave. Some folk get more excited at the prospect of a transfer fee than anything else. Link to comment
afc1903mad Posted September 14, 2021 Share Posted September 14, 2021 7 minutes ago, aberdeen1970 said: It's ages away min. The best part of three years. Behave. Some folk get more excited at the prospect of a transfer fee than anything else. Its not really that far away. Letting players go into their last year of their contract seriously diminishes the negotiating hand. Christmas is only a few months away, from where he will only be 18 months left before going into that last year. I hear we may already be renegotiating with him at the moment, so if we get that extension to 2025 or 2026, then that would be really good, even if it includes a release fee clause. Its not about getting excited for a transfer fee, I'd rather keep him to play, but we are discussing what the club may likely accept, regardless of the length of the contract left Link to comment
Don_Corleone Posted September 14, 2021 Share Posted September 14, 2021 I’m sure they were probably already planning to put a new contract to him on better terms, even if it just extended it by an extra year. It wouldn’t fend off interest but might convince him to stay another season with us before leaving. But let’s be honest if some EPL team comes in for him with an offer of more than 3 or 4 million, he’ll be gone. He has more potential than McKenna or Ferguson but a lot less experience. Link to comment
Ramandu Posted September 14, 2021 Share Posted September 14, 2021 41 minutes ago, Don_Corleone said: I’m sure they were probably already planning to put a new contract to him on better terms, even if it just extended it by an extra year. It wouldn’t fend off interest but might convince him to stay another season with us before leaving. But let’s be honest if some EPL team comes in for him with an offer of more than 3 or 4 million, he’ll be gone. He has more potential than McKenna or Ferguson but a lot less experience. And if he's got any sense, he'll make sure his new contract has a release clause in it, not relying on a gentlemen's agreement. Good for the club too, if the price is clear to all parties. Link to comment
Byrne Baby Byrne Posted September 14, 2021 Share Posted September 14, 2021 1 hour ago, thurso said: He’s as good if not better than both Patterson and the wee fellow who left Celtic for the German team both were quoted of being about £10 million. So that’s what we should be aiming for Fair point from thurso - at last ? Everyone is comparing him to Patterson but Celtic got 11 million from Leverkusen for fitshisface. Admittedly Celtic have plenty more in the bank than us so dont have to sell cheap..... but he didnt appear to be worth anything like that Link to comment
afc1903mad Posted September 14, 2021 Share Posted September 14, 2021 7 minutes ago, Byrne Baby Byrne said: Fair point from thurso - at last ? Everyone is comparing him to Patterson but Celtic got 11 million from Leverkusen for fitshisface. Admittedly Celtic have plenty more in the bank than us so dont have to sell cheap..... but he didnt appear to be worth anything like that Only slight difference is that Frimpong had played for about a season and a half for Celtic and played against higher quality in Europe to assess him against. Not to say Ramsay can't surpass him, but it will still be limited opposition that Ramsay is measured against. On that stance, its laughable to think we can command a similar fee. Link to comment
muttonhumper Posted September 14, 2021 Share Posted September 14, 2021 2 minutes ago, afc1903mad said: Only slight difference is that Frimpong had played for about a season and a half for Celtic and played against higher quality in Europe to assess him against. Not to say Ramsay can't surpass him, but it will still be limited opposition that Ramsay is measured against. On that stance, its laughable to think we can command a similar fee. Aye, and looked absolutely gash on each occasion. Link to comment
slippers Posted September 14, 2021 Share Posted September 14, 2021 2 hours ago, Don_Corleone said: I’m sure they were probably already planning to put a new contract to him on better terms, even if it just extended it by an extra year. It wouldn’t fend off interest but might convince him to stay another season with us before leaving. But let’s be honest if some EPL team comes in for him with an offer of more than 3 or 4 million, he’ll be gone. He has more potential than McKenna or Ferguson but a lot less experience. If we accept that for him it would be a massive disappointment. Doig is rated at 5m having played a season. How does Ramsey compare to Doig? I havnt seen much of him but if he's better than Ramsey he must be some player. Ramsey is on a different planet to any other youth player I've ever seen in a dons shirt in my lifetime. I just hope we can atleast enjoy him till summer and he's Scotland no1 RB by that time and all of a sudden we can command a massive amount more. Link to comment
afc1903mad Posted September 14, 2021 Share Posted September 14, 2021 53 minutes ago, muttonhumper said: Aye, and looked absolutely gash on each occasion. Did he? I honestly don't know to be honest. My recollection was he was an absolute speed demon and was the forefront of much of Celtics attacking creations. He's now playing regularly in the Bundesliga which is afar better league than ours so seems like he can't be that bad. Link to comment
Don_Corleone Posted September 14, 2021 Share Posted September 14, 2021 57 minutes ago, slippers said: If we accept that for him it would be a massive disappointment. Doig is rated at 5m having played a season. How does Ramsey compare to Doig? I havnt seen much of him but if he's better than Ramsey he must be some player. Ramsey is on a different planet to any other youth player I've ever seen in a dons shirt in my lifetime. I just hope we can atleast enjoy him till summer and he's Scotland no1 RB by that time and all of a sudden we can command a massive amount more. I don’t think Hibs are going to get £5m for Doig regardless of whether they rate him at that or not. Doig has more experience but I don’t think he’s any better than Ramsay. Ramsay is on a par with Patterson but Patterson has the advantage of more experience, more European games, Scotland recognition. If Ramsay continues the way he’s going he’ll be in the Scotland squad by the end of the season you’d think and probably pick up the young player of the year award. These kind of things boost a players value I’d guess. Ryan Fraser looked on a completely different level when he broke into the team and didn’t stay long - but his contract was up. You could argue that McKenna looked impressive from the moment he broke into the team and his progression was pretty rapid to Scotland caps (mainly due to our lack in that position) which boosted his value. Scott Wright showed in flashes that he had the ability to be a top player in our league at least, and began to show it consistently when McInnes eventually played him in a position and with other players that suited him. those are the only ones in recent years I can think of - going back a bit further there were guys like mcnaughton and Anderson and prior to that Jess, Booth, Wright etc Ramsay has all the attributes to go right to the top though, similar to Fraser did - albeit he took an unusual route. Link to comment
G31DON Posted September 14, 2021 Share Posted September 14, 2021 Everton paid about 50k for Seamus Coleman, so they will probably offer something like that. Link to comment
slippers Posted September 14, 2021 Share Posted September 14, 2021 32 minutes ago, Don_Corleone said: I don’t think Hibs are going to get £5m for Doig regardless of whether they rate him at that or not. Doig has more experience but I don’t think he’s any better than Ramsay. Ramsay is on a par with Patterson but Patterson has the advantage of more experience, more European games, Scotland recognition. If Ramsay continues the way he’s going he’ll be in the Scotland squad by the end of the season you’d think and probably pick up the young player of the year award. These kind of things boost a players value I’d guess. Ryan Fraser looked on a completely different level when he broke into the team and didn’t stay long - but his contract was up. You could argue that McKenna looked impressive from the moment he broke into the team and his progression was pretty rapid to Scotland caps (mainly due to our lack in that position) which boosted his value. Scott Wright showed in flashes that he had the ability to be a top player in our league at least, and began to show it consistently when McInnes eventually played him in a position and with other players that suited him. those are the only ones in recent years I can think of - going back a bit further there were guys like mcnaughton and Anderson and prior to that Jess, Booth, Wright etc Ramsay has all the attributes to go right to the top though, similar to Fraser did - albeit he took an unusual route. You say Patterson has more experience but Ramsey cant be all that far behind Patterson now given that he starts every game and Patterson has played 1 or 2 games. Absolutely no doubt that Ramsey should be in the Scotland squad next time it comes around but I don't think he will be. Absolutely baffling how Stephen O'donnell is ahead of him. Link to comment
sheepcrooky Posted September 14, 2021 Share Posted September 14, 2021 A great prospect. But we/he needs to monitor his physical growth. He does seem to get minor muscle strains and cramps which might just be part of becoming a professional athlete. Right now, AFC need to give him a better extended contract and he needs to knuckle down here for a couple of years. Link to comment
afc1903mad Posted September 14, 2021 Share Posted September 14, 2021 6 minutes ago, slippers said: You say Patterson has more experience but Ramsey cant be all that far behind Patterson now given that he starts every game and Patterson has played 1 or 2 games. Absolutely no doubt that Ramsey should be in the Scotland squad next time it comes around but I don't think he will be. Absolutely baffling how Stephen O'donnell is ahead of him. Calvin Ramsay has played as much his year as Patterson did last year. Of course, Patterson is ahead this year as a result of playing against Dunfermlin (90 mins), Aleshkert (90 minutes covering Tavernier's absence) and 90 minutes for Scotland against Moldova. A few more games and Ramsay will have played more first team games than Patterson and is nearly two years younger Link to comment
slippers Posted September 14, 2021 Share Posted September 14, 2021 2 minutes ago, afc1903mad said: Calvin Ramsay has played as much his year as Patterson did last year. Of course, Patterson is ahead this year as a result of playing against Dunfermlin (90 mins), Aleshkert (90 minutes covering Tavernier's absence) and 90 minutes for Scotland against Moldova. A few more games and Ramsay will have played more first team games than Patterson and is nearly two years younger Wonder what Patterson makes of being second fiddle to Tavernier. Could really hold back his development the lack of game time. I just don't agree with players not playing for club starting for national team. Ramsey should start and Patterson 2nd choice until he gets a run and proves he should be ahead of Ramsey. In all honesty I despise international football but if it lifts the value of our players I welcome it. Link to comment
afc1903mad Posted September 14, 2021 Share Posted September 14, 2021 1 minute ago, slippers said: Wonder what Patterson makes of being second fiddle to Tavernier. Could really hold back his development the lack of game time. I just don't agree with players not playing for club starting for national team. Ramsey should start and Patterson 2nd choice until he gets a run and proves he should be ahead of Ramsey. In all honesty I despise international football but if it lifts the value of our players I welcome it. Totally agree and I argued that Patterson was undeserving of being called up to the national squad given his gametime this year. Also made a mockery of it for him to play against Moldova and then have a mystery injury which ruled him out of the Austria game. Its strange that theres been no reports on what his injury is, with Steve Clarke opting not to declare. Normally, you'll hear if it was like an ankle knock or a muscle strain. Tavernier is their no1 RB, but you wonder if Balogan potentially is now ahead of Patterson as the back-up RB Link to comment
starryfish Posted September 14, 2021 Share Posted September 14, 2021 Ramsay has done well, makes the signing of Hernandez all the more baffling and concerning, surely the club knew 18 months ago that Ramsay had a chance of breaking through. Link to comment
afc1903mad Posted September 14, 2021 Share Posted September 14, 2021 2 minutes ago, starryfish said: Ramsay has done well, makes the signing of Hernandez all the more baffling and concerning, surely the club knew 18 months ago that Ramsay had a chance of breaking through. Not really. 18 months ago, Ramsay was still 16 and probably not physically ready. Even this year, i think the 1 year signing of Gurr was to allow cover. At the start of his breakthrough, Ramsay was struggling to last 90 minutes, although has made a steady improvement on that front, Cover last year and even this would have been good planning to manage his development and limit the risk of a breakdown 1 Link to comment
Redmist1903 Posted September 14, 2021 Share Posted September 14, 2021 8 minutes ago, starryfish said: Ramsay has done well, makes the signing of Hernandez all the more baffling and concerning, surely the club knew 18 months ago that Ramsay had a chance of breaking through. Yeah but Derek was the manager so he never had a chance. 1 Link to comment
RUL Posted September 14, 2021 Share Posted September 14, 2021 14 minutes ago, Redmist1903 said: Yeah but Derek was the manager so he never had a chance. McInnes talked about ramsay before he was 16. He knew. Link to comment
Itsagoal Posted September 14, 2021 Share Posted September 14, 2021 I think Ramsay should be moved up the pitch to a more attacking position. We’ve now got Bates and Gallagher as CB, so play McRorie at RB and move Ramsay to wide midfield or right wing. He’s definitely better going forward and he’s not afraid to take his man on and his crossing is good. Another advantage is that Ojo can be punted out of the team. 1 Link to comment
Don_Corleone Posted September 14, 2021 Share Posted September 14, 2021 What’s everyone’s thoughts on MacKenzie… arguably he’s been just as good as Ramsay this season. He’s possibly better defensively and does seem quite effective going forward - he just lacks the same pace and maybe the confidence to beat his man every time. I know he is 2-3 years older as well. Does he have the potential to get a move and play at a higher level as well, or is he going to just end up as a good SPL level player? Link to comment
starryfish Posted September 14, 2021 Share Posted September 14, 2021 54 minutes ago, afc1903mad said: Not really. 18 months ago, Ramsay was still 16 and probably not physically ready. Even this year, i think the 1 year signing of Gurr was to allow cover. At the start of his breakthrough, Ramsay was struggling to last 90 minutes, although has made a steady improvement on that front, Cover last year and even this would have been good planning to manage his development and limit the risk of a breakdown Ramsay was on the first team bench in August 2019 so he was already highly thought of even then. Link to comment
Byrne Baby Byrne Posted September 14, 2021 Share Posted September 14, 2021 20 minutes ago, Don_Corleone said: What’s everyone’s thoughts on MacKenzie… arguably he’s been just as good as Ramsay this season. He’s possibly better defensively and does seem quite effective going forward - he just lacks the same pace and maybe the confidence to beat his man every time. I know he is 2-3 years older as well. Does he have the potential to get a move and play at a higher level as well, or is he going to just end up as a good SPL level player? I think he's decent but Ramsay's ceiling is way higher. Ramsay looks like his potential could be 75+ Scotland caps and playing for an established top English/European team. McKenzie looks more like a run your contract down, move to Blackburn, move to Preston then move to Hibs while collecting around 7 caps. Which is better than most players from our youth system and would return a healthy bank balance Link to comment
Millertime Posted September 14, 2021 Share Posted September 14, 2021 1 hour ago, Redmist1903 said: Yeah but Derek was the manager so he never had a chance. Mckenna, Frank Ross, Danny Rogers, ethan ross, Dean campbell, Bruce Anderson , nicky low Link to comment
Millertime Posted September 14, 2021 Share Posted September 14, 2021 53 minutes ago, Don_Corleone said: What’s everyone’s thoughts on MacKenzie… arguably he’s been just as good as Ramsay this season. He’s possibly better defensively and does seem quite effective going forward - he just lacks the same pace and maybe the confidence to beat his man every time. I know he is 2-3 years older as well. Does he have the potential to get a move and play at a higher level as well, or is he going to just end up as a good SPL level player? Yep I think he could be the surprise and go onto a better career He is absolutely solid, which I love Link to comment
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