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Calvin Ramsay

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6 hours ago, sooth_stander said:

Was interesting reading Joel Sked’s interview with Cormack yesterday. Our model now seems to be to overspend our budget by £2m every year and sell players on to service that overspend.

Now obviously, Covid has got in the way so no idea if we are “on track” after selling McKenna and Cosgrove, or whether the entire £4m Ramsay sale will be required to service previous years’ overspending.

I suspect the latter, which would explain Goodwin and Cormack basically putting Ramsay in the Topshop window a few weeks back. Desperation stakes?

Maybe Goodwin will see some of the Ferguson fee? 

 

I wouldn't read it that way 

I'd read it as "We've spent £2M more than we've taken in this season so we have to sell. The same applies if it happens again."

 

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3 minutes ago, Dandyesque said:

I wouldn't read it that way 

I'd read it as "We've spent £2M more than we've taken in this season so we have to sell. The same applies if it happens again."

 

That’s probably why the insurance was in the next set of books. 2m for covid insurance will make these books look better. Thay and imply we are 4m over a standard seasons budget, with next season having no European football at all. The club have went from an absolute fantastic job financially through covid to absolute shambles in space of 12 months! 

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5 hours ago, aberdeen1970 said:

Cormack is a fucking idiot lads, surely that's blatantly obvious by now?

Yup. A complete fucking charlatan. #CalledIt

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It makes me laugh how just cos your at a perceived bigger club, like the cheeks, your transfer value is automatically increased, even if you’ve played less games and even if your a lesser talent.

Anyone explain that one to be?

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14 hours ago, slippers said:

That’s probably why the insurance was in the next set of books. 2m for covid insurance will make these books look better. Thay and imply we are 4m over a standard seasons budget, with next season having no European football at all. The club have went from an absolute fantastic job financially through covid to absolute shambles in space of 12 months! 

Do we make much money from our European games. 

 

39 minutes ago, sooth_stander said:

It makes me laugh how just cos your at a perceived bigger club, like the cheeks, your transfer value is automatically increased, even if you’ve played less games and even if your a lesser talent.

Anyone explain that one to be?

Don’t get into that argument. The reasoning isn’t right. I still need a proper explanation for it. 

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52 minutes ago, sooth_stander said:

It makes me laugh how just cos your at a perceived bigger club, like the cheeks, your transfer value is automatically increased, even if you’ve played less games and even if your a lesser talent.

Anyone explain that one to be?

Yep, quite easily

1) if you're at a bigger club, you have played in front of bigger crowds, in bigger games so proved you have the mentality to cope with it

2) will be on a higher wage, so automatically increases the finances involved

 

Ok?

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, sooth_stander said:

It makes me laugh how just cos your at a perceived bigger club, like the cheeks, your transfer value is automatically increased, even if you’ve played less games and even if your a lesser talent.

Anyone explain that one to be?

Well it is a but frustrating, but ultimately its up to the selling club whether or not they accept any offer. 

Bigger clubs are probably more comfortable knocking back lower offers as the money won't make such a difference to them, whereas our arse starts twitching earlier in the fear that we miss out. 

If the club dont like the offers they don't have to accept. 

Edited by Ernie McCracken

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Posted (edited)
22 minutes ago, Ernie McCracken said:

Well it is a but frustrating, but ultimately its up to the selling club whether or not they accept any offer. 

Bigger clubs are probably more comfortable knocking back lower offers as the money won't make such a difference to them, whereas our arse starts twitching earlier in the fear that we miss out. 

If the club dont like the offers they don't have to accept. 

Wonder how much more we could hold out for if we finished third with group stage European football estimated at 3-4m. Couldn't be in a worse position for negotiating with our loss's in income this season and next! 

Edited by slippers

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1 hour ago, sooth_stander said:

It makes me laugh how just cos your at a perceived bigger club, like the cheeks, your transfer value is automatically increased, even if you’ve played less games and even if your a lesser talent.

Anyone explain that one to be?

It's not so much to do with the player but more the clubs financial clout. Rangers could play hardball with Paterson as their greater turnover means that the money was less important to them. 

It's also the case that Rangers could've probably afforded to make Paterson sign a new contract by throwing a big contract at him. Thereby reducing the risk that he'd run his contract down. 

There's no way we're getting Ramsay to sign a new deal now that teams like Liverpool are sniffing about. 

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1 hour ago, sooth_stander said:

It makes me laugh how just cos your at a perceived bigger club, like the cheeks, your transfer value is automatically increased, even if you’ve played less games and even if your a lesser talent.

Anyone explain that one to be?

It's because the value of a football player is subjective, and so buyers with money can take advantage of desperation. 

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20 hours ago, aberdeen1970 said:

Cormack is a fucking idiot lads, surely that's blatantly obvious by now?

The evidence is certainly mounting.  Very worrying times.  This has probably been the most shambolic season in our recent history. I can't recall the club being in such a mess... even during the Alec Miller/Skovdahl/Pele days....  

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Posted (edited)
24 minutes ago, slippers said:

Wonder how much more we could hold out for if we finished third with group stage European football estimated at 3-4m. Couldn't be in a worse position for negotiating with our loss's in income this season and next! 

Also factor in the fact that it would appear that the figures being bandied about haven't been dismissed out of hand, therefore (consciously or not) we are letting Liverpool (and other clubs) know that £4M won't be too far off the mark for getting the deal done. 

Contrast that to the Watford situation bidding around £1.75 with Ferguson where we told them  straight away to fuck off. Now the figures being talked about are £3m + despite him having a year less on his contract. 

Edited by Ernie McCracken

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5 minutes ago, Sonoftherock said:

The evidence is certainly mounting.  Very worrying times.  This has probably been the most shambolic season in our recent history. I can't recall the club being in such a mess... even during the Alec Miller/Skovdahl/Pele days....  

Hilarious, some of the over reactions on here are priceless, especially to old new which Cormack has already explained, fucking hell.

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1 hour ago, Ernie McCracken said:

Also factor in the fact that it would appear that the figures being bandied about haven't been dismissed out of hand, therefore (consciously or not) we are letting Liverpool (and other clubs) know that £4M won't be too far off the mark for getting the deal done. 

Contrast that to the Watford situation bidding around £1.75 with Ferguson where we told them  straight away to fuck off. Now the figures being talked about are £3m + despite him having a year less on his contract. 

2 years is it not?

And he's now established himself as a regular in the Scotland squad. Way down the pecking order for a regular start of course but every little helps. 

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4 hours ago, Sonoftherock said:

The evidence is certainly mounting.  Very worrying times.  This has probably been the most shambolic season in our recent history. I can't recall the club being in such a mess... even during the Alec Miller/Skovdahl/Pele days....  

His love of rowies & building Cormack park has bought him some sugar daddy cock sucking (with cupping) credit 

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2 hours ago, Ten Caat said:

2 years is it not?

 

A year less until it runs out.

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8 hours ago, Millertime said:

Yep, quite easily

1) if you're at a bigger club, you have played in front of bigger crowds, in bigger games so proved you have the mentality to cope with it

2) will be on a higher wage, so automatically increases the finances involved

 

Ok?

You seem to agree with these views also though.

Lil bit of perspective. Matty Longstaff is valued at £4.5m but I am pretty sure his club would not say they were holding out for that if a club offered them even close to a 1/4 of that figure 🤣

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On 5/10/2022 at 6:21 PM, slippers said:

That’s probably why the insurance was in the next set of books. 2m for covid insurance will make these books look better. Thay and imply we are 4m over a standard seasons budget, with next season having no European football at all. The club have went from an absolute fantastic job financially through covid to absolute shambles in space of 12 months! 

If you look at lost prize money - 10th v budget for 3rd/4th and no semi-finals -  and reduced attendances, I think that's your £2m right there.

Covid losses would be covered by insurance.  Non-Covid losses wouldn't be.

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8 hours ago, TheRedPrawcess said:

From Millertime down all valid points for the unfortunate truth.

Not including though

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On 5/9/2022 at 3:11 PM, Byrne Baby Byrne said:

Wasnt Anderson about 28/29 when he left us? With 1 year left on his contract? It wasn't outstanding money but I don't remember anyone complaining about £1million being low at the time

It was money I recall we would have more than recouped if we actually kept him that next season.

Given:

We shipped 20 more goals in the league the season he was gone

Hemorrhaged 4 in that catastrophic LC semi final at Tynecastle v Dundee Utd

Let another 4 past us in the Scottish Cup semi-final v Queen of the fucking South

Failed to qualify for Europe

 

The first factor is the most telling, but even if we had bettered any one of the other three, we'd have made more than the 3/4 million or whatever it was we actually received.

So losing him for 1 season for that amount of dosh given the effect it had on our defence was very much a shite deal for us.

As I said at the time, though you're not likely to recall my opinion on the matter from 15 odd years ago... 🤣

 

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Posted (edited)
13 minutes ago, muttonhumper said:

It was money I recall we would have more than recouped if we actually kept him that next season.

Given:

We shipped 20 more goals in the league the season he was gone

Hemorrhaged 4 in that catastrophic LC semi final at Tynecastle v Dundee Utd

Let another 4 past us in the Scottish Cup semi-final v Queen of the fucking South

Failed to qualify for Europe

 

The first factor is the most telling, but even if we had bettered any one of the other three, we'd have made more than the 3/4 million or whatever it was we actually received.

So losing him for 1 season for that amount of dosh given the effect it had on our defence was very much a shite deal for us.

As I said at the time, though you're not likely to recall my opinion on the matter from 15 odd years ago... 🤣

 

All great points well made but he also completely fucked his knee pretty much the first game the following season * so we'd have been a million down and paying a defender to sit and do fuck all for a season.

 

* Maybe I imagined that.

Edited by The Boofon

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4 minutes ago, The Boofon said:

All great points well made but he also completely fucked his knee pretty much the first game the following season * so we'd have been a million down and paying a defender to sit and do fuck all for a season.

 

* Maybe I imagined that.

Good point.

Maybe his knee was ready to go, maybe it was just the specific circumstances of the incident or movement when it happened.

Fuck knows.

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2 hours ago, muttonhumper said:

It was money I recall we would have more than recouped if we actually kept him that next season.

Given:

We shipped 20 more goals in the league the season he was gone

Hemorrhaged 4 in that catastrophic LC semi final at Tynecastle v Dundee Utd

Let another 4 past us in the Scottish Cup semi-final v Queen of the fucking South

Failed to qualify for Europe

 

The first factor is the most telling, but even if we had bettered any one of the other three, we'd have made more than the 3/4 million or whatever it was we actually received.

So losing him for 1 season for that amount of dosh given the effect it had on our defence was very much a shite deal for us.

As I said at the time, though you're not likely to recall my opinion on the matter from 15 odd years ago... 🤣

 

Hardly guaranteed that the outcomes that season would've brought in more tangible financial success if we'd kept Anderson.

During that era generally , both with and without Anderson ,we usually failed to qualify for Europe and we were usually on the wrong end of embarrassing cup exits.... including a few others where we conceded 4 goals.

And that season after he was sold , we had more games overall because of our run in Europe and reaching the semis of both domestic cups.  Teams with bigger squads and greater resources than we had at that time have struggled to cope  with the additional European fixtures in particular.

I'm not disputing that Anderson was a very good and influential player for us , but I think you're overstating the effect of losing him had on us.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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2 hours ago, muttonhumper said:

It was money I recall we would have more than recouped if we actually kept him that next season.

Given:

We shipped 20 more goals in the league the season he was gone

Hemorrhaged 4 in that catastrophic LC semi final at Tynecastle v Dundee Utd

Let another 4 past us in the Scottish Cup semi-final v Queen of the fucking South

Failed to qualify for Europe

 

The first factor is the most telling, but even if we had bettered any one of the other three, we'd have made more than the 3/4 million or whatever it was we actually received.

So losing him for 1 season for that amount of dosh given the effect it had on our defence was very much a shite deal for us.

As I said at the time, though you're not likely to recall my opinion on the matter from 15 odd years ago... 🤣

 

You know what, I’ve never thought about that before. 
 

and my life was more enjoyable before I did. 
 

there is not a chance those semi finals would have gone like that with Anderson playing. That was a Scottish cup that was definitely there for the taking as well. 
 

im sure he would have enjoyed the European run more than 1 appearance for Sunderland as well. 1 more season and lose him on a bosman could have been prolific. 
 

fuck you for this thought process muttonhumper. It’s horrible and it’s accurate 

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On 5/11/2022 at 8:34 AM, sooth_stander said:

It makes me laugh how just cos your at a perceived bigger club, like the cheeks, your transfer value is automatically increased, even if you’ve played less games and even if your a lesser talent.

Anyone explain that one to be?

I tried to explain the concept of arbitrage on here a while ago, but everyone's an idiot, so it wasn't a success.

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Alexander Arnold is basically an older version of Ramsay. Can see why Liverpool want him. Decent going forward & great delivery/assists but defensively the weaker side of his game. Just shows how decent team with decent CH’s can cover this & allow the FB’s to be a lot more creative like wing backs

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Hickey apparently on his way to Arsenal for up to €25m, with Hearts set to pocket £3m.

Important we get top Dollar for Ramsay (and Ferguson), but equally that we insert a generous release clause into any sale.

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If he goes to Liverpool then a sell on clause is pretty much next to useless, so we need to maximise the sale to Liverpool in upfront & other clauses.

if he bombs there they sell him for a meagre amount or release him & if he doesn’t bomb they keep him. 

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